Why does LAH attend PAUSD?

1/2 of us in LAH attend, and pay Palo Alto taxes in order to do so. FYI, our average tax payment is much higher than PAs, so we pay more per student to have our kids there.

Don't know what it is now, but 10 years ago we paid an average of 12,000/year in taxes, and PA paid 8,000/year. Sure it has all gone up by now.

And, to add insult to injury, 1/2 of us send our kids to private schools anyway in k-8 because of academics in k-5 and social issues in 6-8.

So, if you want to kick us out, that is fine. You will lose much more money per student loss than you realize. But, hey, please, give us an excuse to take our money back and have our own k-8. I would love it if we could join up with the other half of LAH and turn Bullis into a k-8, with great local control and none of the messy stuff that PAUSD goes through. ( Like worrying about language immersion programs or some of the social brainwashing that happens)

It is like watching the wolves circle in PA sometimes.

Half of Los Altos Hills are legitimately part of the Palo Alto Unified School District, the other half attends Los Altos schools.

The decision was made long before the 1970s because they had their own elementary school, Fremont Hills, which was part of the PAUSD.

Several residents of Los Altos Hills have served on the PAUSD School Board and even become President. At one time Los Altos Hills contributed one third of the PAUSD budget with their taxes.

Los Altos Hills along with Palo Alto Hills and Stanford are all part of the Palo Alto Unified School District. Perhaps the PAUSD should be renamed the Palo Alto, Los Altos Hills, Stanford Unified School District - would that help to clarify the situation?

Paly Alum, you really touched a nerve here!!! Half of Los Altos Hills is very definitely in the Palo Alto Unified School District. If you don't want us, we'll leave and take all our tax dollars with us.

It's worth noting that not all of Palo Alto falls PAUSD, either.

There's a neighborhood in S Palo Alto south of Ventura as you
approach San Antonio that is part of the Los Altos school district.

Cities and school districts aren't the same thing.

Yup, this is a nerve all right. We run into it all the time, the vaguely suspicious eyeing of us, as if we don't really belong here, and we are somehow mooching off of the generosity of Palo Altans, when in fact we have the highest per student rate of donations, taxes and ( just guessing from who I have seen on volunteer committees, PTAs, and Boards over the years) volunteerism.

I am going to assume that the attitude by the original poster is NOT typical of most people, knowing that there are always at least a few nasty people in a crowd, which doesn't by any means reflect the majority. The cream rises to the top,..but I am not sure what settles to the bottom.

The School District does not need to remove LAH students to make room for additional students at Gunn; they need to remove all those who attend PAUSD schools but don't live in the District.

A case in point was reported in the Sunday edition of the PADN in which they wrote: "A Sunnyvale family sent their children to Hoover Elementary by producing a grant deed for a Palo Alto home occupied by the children's grandparents...." The Mother reported that Palo Alto officials never checked to see where the children actually lived.

Hoover Elementary has a waiting list in some grades and yet our School District allows children who live in Sunnyvale to attend. Claims of living in Palo Alto obviously need much greater scrutiny by Staff to clear out non-resident students.

How many LAH students actually attend PAUSD? I am tired of LAH popping off about their money. There is plenty of wealth in PA also. It's just that those LAH people are less modest. They somehow believe that living there has more status when it does not. LAH ends up driving to PA for everything anyway. They also tried to buy their way into our Foothills Park.

Re the "illegal" students attending PAUSD: they ARE being caught. PAUSD will show up at the house at odd hours lookiing for the children and if they are not there, they get booted out of PAUSD.

Yes, look, Los Altos Hills also looks at our Palo Alto website!

They out to change the PAUSD attendance boundaries. Or change half the name of Los Altos Hills to Palo Alto Hills.

PAUSD includes LAH and has for a long time. "We" don't let "them" attend "our" schools - the district belongs just as much to LAH at to PA and Stanford.

Personally I welcome the families from LAH, who have been a fine addition to my children's experience. The sniping between neighborhoods seems overdone to me - LAH families are pretty similar to PA families in my experience.

School boundaries or catchment areas are not the same as city boundaries. The historic reason why the school boundaries have been formed are not a problem. In Palo Alto we have students who live in PA city but also in LA school district. We are not alone. Sunnyvale has an area within the Cupertino schools.

The residents of these areas pay taxes to the relevant school district. You could say, what is in a name, because it is not a city boundary issue but a district boundary issue.

It is a completely different issue to the Tinsley issue.

Perhaps the Palo Alto Unified School District should be renamed The South Peninsula Unified School District since it's boundaries include Palo Alto, Los Altos Hills, Stanford and East Palo Alto when you include the students in the Volunteer Transfer Program.

LAH would throw a fit if the boundaries changed and they were edged out and had to attend all Los Altos schools. They want the good reputation of PAUSD high schools. They also would not want their children mingling with Mountain View students because LAH thinks too well of themselves.

Los Altos Hills wants it both ways. They'd like their elementary children to go to Bullis Elementary School which is located in LAH but is in the Los Altos School District. Then they want their children to go to Terman Middle School and Gunn High School. Their argument is these schools are closer to LAH than Egan Middle School and Los Altos High School in the Los Altos School District.

If LAH students want Gunn High School I'd stick with Nixon and Terman. If you want to transfer into Gunn later, you might get sent to Palo Alto High School because Gunn is full.

Those in Los Altos Hills should have bought in Palo Alto if they want to use the Palo Alto schools. They should go to Los Altos High with the rest of Los Altos.

Appears to be an high level of entitlement from those writing from LAH. Also, a lot of false bluffing going on here. If you are really that disgruntled to pay the taxes for your kids to attend one of the top 50 high schools in the country, then perhaps your money should be taken back so that your kids can attend one of the other neighboring community high schools such as in Los Altos or Mountain View.

"They should go to Los Altos High with the rest of Los Altos."

But that's no different than those kids going to Palo Alto schools. Los Altos and Los Altos Hills are separate towns.

The way some of these posts disrespect our Los Altos Hills neighbors distresses me. Would you be willing to say these remarks in person face to face? These posts also ignore the legitimacy of historical governance decisions.

Not only as others have pointed out are the Los Altos Hills families legitimately a part of PAUSD and not only do they pay more to attend, they are wonderful families who add so much to our schools. We love the families from Los Altos who attend Nixon, Terman and Gunn. The parents volunteer, staff and contribute to PTA and PiE, and contribute to our schools in a myriad of ways. The children are wonderful friends and students. The families love and cherish education as much as the rest of us. They are our neighbors and friends. Some of us are extremely thanksful to have them as part or our community.

Hey, its simple. Los Altos Hills is a different city than Los Altos. Los Altos Hills has NO HIGH SCHOOLS (duh). But kids are required by state law to be allowed to attend public school.

So the cities of Los Altos and Palo Alto (and I think probably Cupertino too) to basically split the town of Los Altos Hills to get the kids into one HS or another. (And they are well compenstated for it.)

There's no particular reason they should be going to Los Altos schools any more than Palo Alto's (just coincident that they share part of the same town name) Original poster could have just as easily whined 'why don't we make them go to cupertino school?' Sure, we could do that, then they'd take their $ and go to Cupertino schools, and probably be better off for it besides.

Wow, why are we giving the people from Los Altos Hills such grief. They've been part of the district for years and have had to put with having no elementary school actually in their neighborhood--or, rather, their neighborhood school's been rented out for years.

I think the false residency issue is a real one. I think that there's a fair amount of kids whose families once were PA residents, but then moved. Once you're in the system, no one's checking.

OhlonePar,

Great to see you back in your element. You strayed for a while, and it did not flatter you. No matter, you are back where you belong, and I am happy to read your opinions on education issues.

Actually, LAH has its own public school, but it has agreed to pay more to keep it private: Freemont Hills, currently, Pinewoood.

Instead of complaining about the kids from Los Altos Hills, complain about all the HIGH DENSITY HOUSING being forced on the area.

More housing = more people = more kids in the school systems.

There's something to complain about!

Just to be clear.

School district boundaries are not based on cities. It is wrong for Palo Alto residents to conclude that PAUSD should be for Palo Alto only. The name is actually a misnomer. PAUSD includes more than just Palo Alto and the naming is unfortunate because it causes "problems" like the negativity that is expressed here.

I haven't seen any commenter mentioning Pinewood School which is in Los Altos Hills (on Fremont). LAH gave it to Palo Alto in exchange for North LAH going to PA schools. PAUSD leases it to a private school, which provides income for PAUSD. If PA folks are upset by this whole arrangement, they should ask PAUSD to get out of the Pinewood deal and give that site back to LAH. There's nothing particularly magical about PA schools. High achievement is attributable mostly to the Stanford parentage of many of the pupils, and/or parents willing to spend big bucks on outside instruction (Kumon, Score, etc.). The district's teaching and school programs, per se? Ok, not extraordinary.

why so much conflict, you pay taxes, you use the service, pretty simple no?

mark - or anyone -- where are extraordinary teachers and schools? we are new in the area and currently renting an apt. we have about a month to buy and get into schl district. everyone we talk to raves @ their own district schools and community. seems like its a choice between good A and good B. (no one has used the term excellent, btw.) we really like many areas and towns, Palo Alto Downtown, On-Campus, Los Altos, Los Altos Hills, Menlo Park, Portola Valley. we have elem - middle and high school. thoughts/ suggestions??

newneighbor, it depends somewhat on what your goals are for your child and what your child's learning style is.

With Palo Alto's Stanford community and a lot of high achievers who seek Palo Alto out, I find that kids at the "high" end are well served here. Likewise kids at the "low" end (especially the special ed kids) are well served due to legal mandates.

Kids in the middle? Not so much. My daughter has a tested IQ of 130 but is not academically inclined. She never learned long division in elementary school, probably because she wasn't paying attention the one day they covered it. I think teachers are dazzled by the super high achievers and not sure at what level to teach. There's no tracking, so they're hampered by a very large range inside each classroom. At the high school level, this problem tends to get worse. My son's Bio teacher was so busy fending off the kids who were asking questions she had to look up the answers to, that the average bright kids (e.g., my son) were confused and lost.

Also, you should know that unless your child is a crazed over-achiever -- by that I mean happy to spend 6-8 hours per day outside of school on his/her extracurricular activities (jazz band, editing yearbook, etc.) -- then getting into college with a degree from Gunn or Paly will be *more difficult* than getting into college with the same GPA and test scores from a 'lesser' high school.

PAUSD keeps tables showing every single college application in the district each year. Rows in the table are individual students (with no identifying information) showing their GPA (computed three different ways), SAT Verb, SAT math, SAT writing, and SAT II scores. These are grouped by college, and as to whether the student was admitted or not to the particular college. Means and medians are also given. Looking at these averages for the University of California schools, you can see that they are several points higher than the published GPA and SAT means for each school statewide. Making up an example here, you can go to UC San Diego's web page and see that average entering freshman GPA is 3.89, but in PAUSD's book for those admitted, average GPA is 4.15. Same with SATs, average math score for the school might be 690, but average for the PAUSD kids admitted was 710.

Basically, your child is competing against a much higher standard in PAUSD and UCs must have decided they can't necessarily admit every single PAUSD student who scores above the statewide average as that would be too many PAUSD students. So they use a higher standard for us. If your kids are academically inclined or can take that kind of competitive heat, then great go for PAUSD. If they're just average bright you might want to consider somewhere else.

Also, the 'rankings' you will sometimes see thrown around can be very misleading. In a recent ranking, Gunn High School came in somewhere between 50th and 100th. Pretty good! But looking at the schools that did better, TWO schools in Nashville TN ranked between 20th & 30th. So, should you live in Nashville TN for your kids' education? You be the judge.

Good luck.

Mark: Your account of the history of Fremont Hills (Pinewood) is wrong. All LAH elementary kids in the 1950s who attended PAUSD schools went to Loma Vista. Loma Vista became overcrowded so the PAUSD built Fremont Hills and all the kids on the Palo Alto side of LAH were transferred into Fremont Hills together with all the elementary children living in Palo Alto Hills.

Lucille M. Nixon was built in the 1960s, and to help fill that school the children from Palo Alto Hills and some LAH kids were transferred into Nixon. Sadly, in the 1970s this left Fremont Hills with declining enrollment, so after 13 years, it was closed and all the remaining elementary children from LAH were transferred to Lucille M. Nixon where they are today.

The former Fremont Hills was then leased by the PAUSD to Pinewood for their High School. However, if the PAUSD keeps growing in numbers, Fremont Hills could be taken back and re-opened.

I have no kids.
However, I know of at least 3 families who live in San Jose, Sunnyvale, and even Almaden area and use a friend's or relative's address to send their kids to PA schools.
If I had a kid, I would look into that for many reasons rather than getting angry at those who still follow the law.

Newneighbor,

No magic. We don't have any extraordinary schools around here, though we do have some extraordinary teachers (they are scattered and it is luck of the draw). We do have many good schools, so I wouldn't worry about exactly which school in this area (also, no guarantee of elementary school this late).

Part of the reason the schools are good is the emphasis on education by families in this area; part of the reason is the wealth.

For your elem kids, you do have a few choices of learning style (see pausd website for choice programs), though the lotteries are long over and you'd have to go onto a waiting list. Read up on it with your kid's learning style in mind.

Our experience differs from Mark's: I don't think kids at the "high" end are well-served here. The system is geared to bringing up the bottom and middle (often with the help of parents, tutors, etc.), sometimes with lots of hard work by the kids. So if your kid is bottom or middle and naturally a hard worker (or if you push them hard), they'll do well and become "high-achievers" (or at least "better achievers"). But the the system does nothing for kids who start at the "high" end: they are left to shift for themselves, waiting as the math curriculum spirals endlessly and the spelling words never challenge.

I do think Mark is right that there is a lot of competitive heat, especially in the upper grades, and it's worth considering how that will affect your kids.

Mark,

Those sound like interesting tables. Are they available online?

To LAH residents

The vast majority of PA residents are not concerned about this issue as it is really just the fact that the name of the District is PA but perhaps should be PA and district USD. The ones here who are complaining just don't understand the situation and are looking for reasons to prevent some of the overflow situations we have. The schools your kids attend don't have the overflow situations that many other, particularly elementary and kindergarten in particular, areas of the district have. When someone can't get into the elementary school which is just down the road, or round the corner, and instead they have to drive (we don't get school buses) to the other side of town in rush hour conditions, they understandably get upset. For them, any decrease in numbers would seem to help their case. Generally speaking, when these people fully understand, they are like minded with the rest of us.

Why don't we abide by the existing rules we have for the PAUSD school district before we talk about changing the rules?
I know many families that are using the address of relatives and friends to attend PAUSD schools. Why do we allow this to continue? I know some children who are in this country illegally who are being educated in PAUSD. Let's work on enforcing the existing rules we have in place before we go after the people paying their fair share.

I have no kids.

However, I know of at least 3 families who live in San Jose, Sunnyvale, and even Almaden area and use a friend's or relative's address to send their kids to PA schools.

If I had a kid, I would look into that for many reasons rather than getting angry at those who still follow the law.

Why don't we abide by the existing rules we have for the PAUSD school district before we talk about changing the rules?
I know many families that are using the address of relatives and friends to attend PAUSD schools. Why do we allow this to continue? I know some children who are in this country illegally who are being educated in PAUSD. Let's work on enforcing the existing rules we have in place before we go after the people paying their fair share.

Why don't we abide by the existing rules we have for the PAUSD school district before we talk about changing the rules?
I know many families that are using the address of relatives and friends to attend PAUSD schools. Why do we allow this to continue? I know some children who are in this country illegally who are being educated in PAUSD. Let's work on enforcing the existing rules we have in place before we go after the people paying their fair share.

Why don't we abide by the existing rules we have for the PAUSD school district before we talk about changing the rules?
I know many families that are using the address of relatives and friends to attend PAUSD schools. Why do we allow this to continue? I know some children who are in this country illegally who are being educated in PAUSD. Let's work on enforcing the existing rules we have in place before we go after the people paying their fair share.

LAH grandma, doesn't seem like my account was THAT wrong. I guess you mean my suggestion that LAH built Fremont Hills/Pinewood and then traded it for attendance in PAUSD. Your claim is that LAH has always attended PA schools and that PAUSD built Fremont for them. Both accounts make the same points, I think you'll agree:

1. LAH is rightfully and legally a part of PAUSD and has been for some time
2. Pinewood is a PAUSD *financial* asset that could be reclaimed for use by students if PAUSD is will to give up the lease income from it.

Mark

Yes to No. 2, and further it would make a great commuter school for all the boutique programs, SI, MI, Ohlone (with farm) and Hoover, and then look at all the space we would have all over the district at the elementary level. In fact, put Connections and DI, in for middle school and we would have middle school space too.

If you know a family who resides outside of PAUSD that is sending their child(ren) here illegally, PLEASE REPORT THEM TO THE SCHOOL DISTRICT. You can do so anonymously. The way our district is funded, more students mean each one gets a smaller amount of money - illegal students are stealing resources from the students who are residents of PAUSD. I believe the district gives families a time limit to move into Palo Alto, they will not kick the kids out of school that day.

I know you might feel bad reporting them - but if they were stealing food, water, mail, etc. from you or your neighbors, would you report them? This is no different - they are deliberately stealing from children - many who have families that sacrifice a lot to send their kids to school here legally.

Mark,

You have a point regarding Nashville -- a small one tinged with prejudice. No one should base their Nashville comments on stereotypical images of the south (ie. education, weather, people...) Nashville was named the Athens of the south for a reason in that there are over seventeen universities and colleges in the metro area. It draws not only the creative types, but the alpha families as well. Silicon Valley is not the only location to do so.

My child is in the school ranked 23rd in the nation by Newsweek. We have been in PAUSD.

So as to your point about competition, by moving here in a transfer, I guess I have placed my children in a very good competitive position as they apply to schools not only in CA but nationally. My children will help diversify. The CA university system will see by child born in CA as a southern inner city child with 4.0+ who takes only honor or AP course load as well as engineering courses every year on top of what is required by the school. The requirement is four years of both math and science. I believe CA still requires only two years of math, but I am sure many take more than that.

I do not make this point by slamming PAUSD. I think PA and its surrounding areas get entrenched in their thinking that their system is the best......when you leave, you find out.....it is indeed very good, but not necessarily the best. Don't know which system out there is. However, I do think Silicon Valley schools should have engineering and more health science courses in their offerings based on the dominant industries located there.

I always concern the school closing my home for my kids. The reason is for my kid's safety to avoid the headache of transportation. Also public school should provide their service to their neighborhood.

I live in Page mill. Gunn high school is close my home. It is not make sense that I have to drive my kids to Los Altos high school in the traffic time.

Although Foothill College is a community college located on LAH, but open to anyone. The open door policy benefits to the students, the school and community.

Kevin,

I am always in my element. It doesn't say much about you that you couldn't confront me in the other thread and wanted to drag something off-topic over here in order to get in a little jab.

Parent,

The Lottery programs have around a 1,000 students, so no, putting them at one location doesn't wash.

OhlonePar, I was a little disturbed by Kevin's comment also. You have always had stable and sane input.

Let's rename the District LAH SPA!

(Los Altos Hills Stanford Palo Alto)

Paly Alum,

Thank you for your comments. I wasn't reading much of the Forum for the last few days--I think Kevin was peeved that I didn't see his other comment--or one I assume to be his. He wants me to know he's mad at me.

Back to topic.

FWIW, by the way, some of the LAH parents have posted before that they were told by the district that they're probably never going to have Pinewood back. It's weird, we have this rich, exclusive area that's treated in sort of a poor-relations way by the district.

I think that the LAH crowd is, even now, a relatively small one and it will stay that way--no one's going to be building condos and townhouses up there.

One thing to keep in mind is that a chunk of LAH abuts Page Mill. Palo Alto sort of half encircles it--so there are kids in Palo Alto who live much farther away and higher up the hill than do the kids in LAH. Geographically, the LAH kids going to PAUSD schools sort of makes sense.

The boundary thing I find odd is that there's a chunk of Portola Valley that also feeds into PAUSD--but Portola Valley's in another county. Anyone know how that came about--sort of came with the Stanford lands, maybe?

As far as Gunn goes, though, what's going to happen when all those developments are finished and occupied in South Palo Alto--it seems like all the developments are in Gunn's catchment area. And boy is Gunn a name brand.

> 1/2 of us in LAH attend, and pay Palo Alto taxes in order to do so.

Everyone in LAH pays the same property taxes (Prop.13 is statewide), with the exception of the parcel taxes. Parcel taxes are paid to the school jurisdiction which impose them.

Property taxes in LAH are generally higher because the property values in LAH are generally higher than in Palo Alto.

Wonder how people come to think this way? People who live in the PAUSD jurisdiction are so incredibly uneducated--about so many things!

Ohlone

I realise that the numbers of students in the choice programs is too big for one location, my thoughts were that if the choice programs were moved only those who really wanted to drive their kids there would choose them and the others who really choose the choice programs because they live near them, would stay out of them. This means that the choice programs would really be for those who wanted them for their programming rather than their location.

But, since I doubt it would happen, it is a moot point anyway. As an example, if you as an Ohlone family were told that the program was moving to Pinewood/Fremont Hills, would you change or go into a local school?

Parent,

No, I wouldn't change schools, but I wouldn't be thrilled about having to drive cross town twice a day at current gas prices.

Hoover makes sense as a site because it's very, very close to two other neighborhood schools--that corridor doesn't need three neighborhood schools.

Greenfell makes sense as a lottery school location because it's at Cubberly--it's ideal for a commuter school and not for a neighborhood one. It's also close to the Hoover/Fairmeadow/El Carmelo corridor

Pinewood? It's a fairly big site, So, yeah, you could put Ohlone there. I'd rather see, though, something like an IB program to pick up some of the crowding at the high school level (and just for the record, I probably wouldn't have my kids go the IB route--but if you're going to go the super-academic route, I think IB's a better option than the mish-mash AP route.)

So, I'd rather see MI go to the half of Greenfell opening up in 2010, Garland serving the Green Gables neighborhood, so kids in the triangle could walk safely to school. Ohlone expands to, but doesn't go over 4 strands, while smaller sites, such as the schools in the north cluster get a little yard space back.

Ohlone Par: To clarify who in the Hills attends Palo Alto Schools. It is rather complicated.

Half of Los Altos Hills and Palo Alto Hills attend the PAUSD. However, when LAH was split into two sections many of the areas now built on did not have houses when the split was made. So, all new houses built on what was at one time unincorporated areas of the hills now send their children to Los Altos Schools. However, some children living way up Page Mill Road almost to Skyline attend PAUSD schools.

The two school districts are a patch work. If you live on one section of Briones you're in the PAUSD if you live in another section you attend Los Altos Schools.

As for Portola Valley children attending PAUSD they used to get inter-district transfers.

It's quite,

Thanks for the back story. I know about the kids way up near Skyline being at PA schools--I had a substitute babysitter one time from up there. It was a hell of a drive.

It looks like, from the maps, that PAUSD does serve some families in Portola Valley living adjacent to Foothills Park, but south of Alpine. For some reason, Gunn seems to be the school that gets all the hill kids--on the theory, I suppose that people come down Page Mill and then move over pretty easily to Arastradero. Still, it's funny that it's over county lines.

It's not just a frivolous decision on the part of the school board (that's what the original post implies). School districts are created based on a geographical property tax boundary, not necessarily the same as city boundaries. Parts of Los Altos Hills are included in the PAUSD boundary and property tax assessments from the homes in those areas go to PAUSD. The same effect can be seen in Cupertino for example, where parts of Sunnyvale and Santa Clara are in the Cupertino school district.

If there were a vote to remove those homes from PAUSD, then those homes could get re-assigned to a different district (which would also have to vote to accept them). This would likely trigger legal opposition and also result in a rather rich tax base going to the receiving school district.

In short, a school district isn't run by the city. It's a separate entity with geographical boundaries of its own.