Read the full story here Web Link posted Friday, October 27, 2023, 1:27 PM
https://n2v.paloaltoonline.com/square/print/2023/10/27/opinion-a-proposal-regarding-the-future-of-cal-ave--a-compromise
Town Square
Opinion: A proposal regarding the future of Cal Ave — a compromise
Original post made on Oct 27, 2023
Read the full story here Web Link posted Friday, October 27, 2023, 1:27 PM
Comments
a resident of Gunn High School
on Oct 27, 2023 at 1:53 pm
Herman is a registered user.
"can't be worse" ??? Opening the street would obviously and certainly negatively affect most restaurants, especially the popular ones who are the only reason Cal Ave has any attention and foot traffic at all.
In turn, potentially hurts smaller businesses as now there is no reason at all to walk by overpriced shops closing before dinner. Rent is too high for shops outdated, let larger businesse populate the street.
You mentioned it's dead aside from dinner because top restaurants carry the street. Now you're hurting the only businesses doing anything for the street instead of capitalizing on it and supporting it like Santana Row, Castro MV, Murphy SV Broadway RWC, and many streets in San Mateo have done. Everyone would rather drive to Stanford Shopping or a more reasonably priced and useful store around the bay.
Review the benefits you listed:
• Improve visibility for all businesses on Cal Ave.
(Not really because you should be focused on driving and not hitting kids who are used to playing here and you are reducing walking traffic for sure which are best bet to actually buy stuff as before with open street you could never park anywhere)
• Maintain open spaces for outdoor dining and recreational parklets.
(This isn't a benefit haha)
• Reduce the use of residential streets by commuters getting to the Caltrain station.
(There's already a bunch of free parking now this doesn't affect the street and businesses either_
• Route incoming business traffic away from residential streets.
(Again only affects maybe 1 or two streets and we have giant parking, much better more beneficial ways of dealing with this issue which isn't relevant to small businesses in support of street open)
• Provide emergency access for police and fire services.
(Already there, not a benefit)
Keep the street closed allowing restaurants and shops to invest in the outdoors. Have events, art, flowers, lights, etc.
Realize the harsh reality the business isn't doing poor cause of the street.
a resident of Charleston Meadows
on Oct 27, 2023 at 3:45 pm
Local news junkie is a registered user.
This seems like an excellent compromise.
a resident of Embarcadero Oaks/Leland
on Oct 27, 2023 at 4:31 pm
Online Name is a registered user.
Thanks to the business people who put together this piece and didn't cost hundreds of thousands of dollars to do so like the international and national consultants with no local knowledge on which the city's wasting OUR tax dollars.
Let's recall the harm done to the Cal Ave retailers during the many years the street was closed during the [portion removed] beautification project that was plagued by cost over-runs and lengthy delays which the city spokeswoman reflexively defended. [Portion removed.]
a resident of Palo Verde
on Oct 27, 2023 at 5:29 pm
cheese guy is a registered user.
I have to agree with Herman, this compromise just falls short. I seriously doubt that opening one-way traffic in a single lane is going to increase business for places such as the Cobblery in any meaningful manner. It will produce the possibility for more pedestrian vs. car accidents due to the rather unique traffic pattern (I can't think of any other urban setting with such a design, so people will be in a novel setting where attention can lag). The relatively quiet atmosphere of the street, which to me now resembles many European settings where entire sections of downtown are closed to car traffic, would be lost with little or nothing gained. Cars are going to have to exit the area via the neighborhood side streets, so there is minimal overall reduction in traffic since the side streets will still be used for all exiting and a fair amount of entry to the area. I say let's make the whole closure permanent, spend some money to tear up part of the asphalt and put in some decorative planting, trees, benches-- make the whole area a quiet, lovely place to shop and have a meal. If you do that, people will come.
a resident of Mountain View
on Oct 27, 2023 at 5:42 pm
One Town Over is a registered user.
I am officially calling for a Humanitarian Pause on closed Cal Ave. We need to allow cars to come through and needed aid to reach the decimated retail shops.
a resident of another community
on Oct 27, 2023 at 7:49 pm
MyFeelz is a registered user.
One Town Over: LOL
As for the "compromise", please explain to me like a kindergartener how this works:
"We propose reopening one lane of California Avenue from El Camino Real to Birch Street for one-way vehicle traffic as well as a dedicated bike lane. The remainder of the street from Birch to the Caltrain station would remain unchanged."
Is there helicopter service to lift the cars to get back to the nearest 2-way street? Honestly it's been so long since I've been there, but the photo that was used in this article is the back side of the "gum splattered asphalt restaurant row" where there is so much construction right behind the lens, that impedes all traffic at times. It's a little bit (actually a lot) disingenuous to post a deceptive photo. Show us the ugly El Camino side, with the lame "mini golf" ... ugh. You have to either have kids or be drunk to play golf in the streets on California Ave. The area proposed for the compromise has TWO disabled parking spots. So a disabled person would have a long way to travel to any of the businesses that are further down the road in either direction. The point of having disabled parking is ACCESSIBILITY. Not just to get a free parking spot where you would then have to get your wheelchair out and god forbid, cross the street where nobody knows the configuration. If I had a nickel for every Tesla parked in a disabled space to avoid getting door dings I'd have a pile of nickels. Frankly I'm surprised there hasn't been a lawsuit because disabled people have been barred from access for 3 years now. For all I know there could be lots of lawsuits that managed to get quashed in the name of "Uhruh complainers are just looking for a quick buck." Businesses that are in public streets are occupying disabled parking with tents are breaking state and federal laws. Not to mention the fact that those businesses are not paying more taxes for the privilege of taking away disabled access.
Just open the dang street, already
a resident of Mountain View
on Oct 28, 2023 at 8:58 am
One Town Over is a registered user.
[Post removed.]
a resident of Midtown
on Oct 28, 2023 at 1:04 pm
Rik is a registered user.
Cars are dirty, dangerous, and totally unnecessary on California Ave. We have to move away from the 1950s car centrist urbanization and enjoy walking, biking and strolling through the community. I was born in Copenhagen, Denmark where the city long walking street is the center of city life. Shops thrive, street performers entertain, restaurants feed and mobile mass of pedestrians. Yes, some shops have failed on California Ave, but to blame that on the street closure is unscientific. COVID, changing buying habits (online), rising rents and poor management are more likely causes. As a disabled person myself, I MUCH rather have no cars in public spaces that more handicap spots. Cars do not see me in a wheelchair and crossing 4 lanes is daunting. Let us make California Ave a new model in community interaction and forgo isolating and polluting cars. Let us look towards the better future rather than recreate a 1950s past.
a resident of College Terrace
on Oct 28, 2023 at 5:14 pm
Annette is a registered user.
Good Grief but it takes forever to reach a conclusion in this town. We've had since March 2019 to think about this and how to reconfigure the sidewalk and street areas in the most beneficial way for both retail and restaurants. I think everyone can agree that no single approach will be ideal for all stakeholders. But we are approaching 2024 so it's very easy to conclude that getting this done (or even making progress) in a way that is as good as possible simply isn't a priority for the City Manager and his team. Frankly, I am beginning to wonder what the priorities are b/c University Ave isn't so great these days, either. The streets need to be cleaned regularly and swept far more frequently. Especially awful: dog poop that is not cleaned up. Especially creepy: the large, low black boxes that one sees along the walls of buildings that are used to capture rodents. Yech.
Is there a schedule for cleaning the pavement that all the restaurants are using? I'd like to see that published.
So, we are killing retail (is that deliberate?) and not doing a great job managing the street closures. I am certain Palo Alto can do better - if it wants to. City Manager: please let's hear some specifics from you about this.
My "vote" on this: restaurants have had priority for the last few years; I think it's time to give retail a better chance and I'd ask the business owners what that should look like as they will surely know better than I.
a resident of Barron Park
on Oct 29, 2023 at 8:12 am
Pierce Layton is a registered user.
Now that Country Sun is closing, what are the remaining retail stores along California Avenue that will thrive with this one-lane proposition?
a resident of Evergreen Park
on Oct 29, 2023 at 10:55 am
Melinda Dillon is a registered user.
@Pierce Layton
California Avenue has become a dining district with declining and minimal retail store activity. The street closure was implemented to expand dining capacity during the pandemic and outside of the few remaining businesses remaining, there is no reason to venture out there other than to dine or to visit a hairstylist.
a resident of South of Midtown
on Oct 29, 2023 at 4:27 pm
Walter is a registered user.
Ms. Dillon -- consider for a moment that the city of Palo Alto has decided to prioritize the success of restaurants. As managers of economic development, as neighbors and as consumers, they should also want to see success for everyday service providers: grocers, a hardware store, a dry cleaner, an independent coffee roaster, a barber; without these, Cal Ave is just a tourist district without the tourists. Tenants signed leases on California with the basic expectation that they would be doing business on a city street. City managers now want to re-imagine this commercial corridor but are willing to let the 'study' phase drag on for years. In what year would you guess the project would be completed? Is 2026 too generous an estimate? Business people paying rent on California deserve better.
a resident of Evergreen Park
on Oct 29, 2023 at 9:41 pm
Rishi - resident is a registered user.
CITY: Please compromise or reopen Cal Ave circa 2019 (layout won’t cost as much, it’s known). Stop hiring expensive 3rd parties to do your work. Why did you (we) pay for the fancy ‘power point people’ before doing a financial study? We neighbors keep pondering, who are city staff making these decisions, why. We’re tired of the commercial traffic scrambling though our side streets. Cars/delivery trucks are inevitable. We understood the closure at peak pandemic, but it is LONG past time to move on. Talk of ‘European/pedestrian friendly’? We aren’t Europe. REMEMBER? We taxpayers funded 'pedestrian' 10+ years ago going 4 lanes to 2 = wider sidwalks. Why’s the city only proposing ONE option, closed long term? My salon, my physical therapist? They were never included in city outreach. Threads make it sound like only restaurants/retail voices count? NO. All offices, services, businesses count & all have opinions, residents too. Talk to the locals? Most businesses are kind & care about everyone in our district. I value those willing to compromise for the great good. Is the city communicating w/ people managing all the vacancies? We need a healthy neighborhood, not a vacant ghost town b/c people want to keep saying ‘European’. Curious, how many businesses are in Cal Ave, how many did the city contact? Not the people I know! I’m sad when I hear, ‘Why tell the city, they won’t care’. Ask your local spots, has the city your opinion? Residents deserves the basics (market, dry cleaner, hardware store, CPA, PT, salon, hardware, pharmacy, gift store, etc…) NOTE: those places need to make a living to stay in business. We can’t be so short-sided that a few hours of dining can sustain any healthy district. Yep, we all shop online, retail has changed but we should want a district that still supports our basic needs. Offices, services, retail, restaurants, AND residents, we all matter & deserve a district that is useful & supportive to all of of us for the long term.
a resident of College Terrace
on Oct 29, 2023 at 9:46 pm
Annette is a registered user.
Walter makes an excellent point: Tenants signed leases on California with the basic expectation that they would be doing business on a city street. If the City is going to keep Cal Ave as is, the retailers who are disadvantaged should be compensated in some way. After all, the restaurants have effectively increased the sf of their space at no cost. There's got to be some way to offset the revenue that retailers have lost.
a resident of Evergreen Park
on Oct 29, 2023 at 10:00 pm
Rishi - resident is a registered user.
CITY: Please compromise OR reopen Cal Ave to pre-COVID (2019 layout won’t cost as much, it’s known). Stop hiring expensive 3rd parties to do your work. Why did you (we) pay for the fancy ‘power point people’ before doing a financial study? We neighbors keep pondering, who are city staff making these decisions, why. We’re tired of the commercial traffic scrambling though our side streets. Cars/delivery trucks are inevitable. We understood the closure at peak pandemic, but it is LONG past time to move on. Talk of ‘European/pedestrian friendly’? We aren’t Europe. REMEMBER? We taxpayers funded ‘pedestrian’ 10+ years ago going 4 lanes to 2, widening sidewalks. Why’s the city only proposing ONE option, closed long term? My salon, my physical therapist? Never included in city outreach. These threads make it sound like only restaurants/retail voices count? NO. All offices, services, businesses count & all have opinions, residents too. Talk to the locals! Most businesses are kind & care about everyone in our district. We value those willing to compromise for the great good. Is the city communicating w/ people managing all the vacancies? Healthy neighborhood please! Not a vacant ghost town b/c people want to keep saying ‘European’. Curious, how many businesses are in Cal Ave, how many did the city reach out to? Not the people I know. I’m sad when I hear, ‘Why tell the city, they won’t care’. Ask your peeps, did the city asked your opinion? We deserve a local district that provides basics (market, dry cleaner, hardware store, CPA, PT, salon, hardware, pharmacy, gift store, etc…) NOTE: those places need to make a living to stay in business. We can’t be so short-sided that a few hours of dining can sustain any healthy district. Yep, we all shop online, retail changed but we should want a district that still supports our basic needs. Offices, services, retail, restaurants, AND residents, we all matter & deserve a district that is useful & supportive to all of us
a resident of Portola Valley
on Oct 30, 2023 at 10:26 am
historyguy is a registered user.
The compromise proposal of the merchants on CA avenue (which includes one major restauranteur) makes a lot of sense to me and would allow the gathering of new data that can help the city make a final and definitive decision. And it would be fair to all concerned.
a resident of Woodside
on Oct 30, 2023 at 11:05 am
Claudette is a registered user.
Open California avenue . We want to come back.
a resident of Evergreen Park
on Oct 30, 2023 at 11:31 am
Matt is a registered user.
The overwhelming opinion of the local community is to keep California Ave closed to cars (and to reconfigure the street to make it permanent). I live 2 blocks away and agree with my neighbors. Opening one lane would go completely against local community opinion which should be the strongest voice.
a resident of Duveneck/St. Francis
on Oct 30, 2023 at 12:45 pm
Anonymous is a registered user.
Open California Ave. Many, many of us don’t live within walking distance.
a resident of Palo Verde
on Oct 30, 2023 at 10:29 pm
scott is a registered user.
No. People have had a taste of a car-free public space, and we're not going back. One-lane is not car free. The proposed "compromise" is worse than either of the two alternatives it's trying to split the difference between.
Cars have almost the entire rest of the city. We're keeping Cal Ave for people. *That* is the compromise.
a resident of Palo Alto Orchards
on Oct 31, 2023 at 10:54 am
hastern is a registered user.
Open the street already. The restaurants have had the advantage for long enough. If they need more space maybe they can RENT one of the empty storefronts.
Perhaps if the street is open, retail might return.
a resident of Evergreen Park
on Oct 31, 2023 at 12:28 pm
CalAveLocal is a registered user.
For all the people who are saying that Cal Ave needs to open because they do not live within walking distance - can you please tell me how often you actually parked on Cal Ave? There are several parking lots and a large parking structure just off the street. Thats where you would park in any case.
Driving down California Ave has been a huge hassle when it was open. It was slow, one had to be super careful to make sure not to run over someone and it was start and go the entire way. I would avoid driving on it at all costs - would always take a parallel street.
Now, imagining a one lane solution - that would be aweful all around. We would have a line of bumper to bumper slow moving cars during the dinner and lunch hours, which would make eating out unpleasant, decreasing the number of people dining. I do not believe that the retail sales would increase as we only have destination shops here; and restaurant business will certainly decrease.
a resident of College Terrace
on Oct 31, 2023 at 2:50 pm
mjh is a registered user.
I couldn't disagree with CalAveLocal more. Even after Cal Ave was reduced from four lanes to two I did not find it so inconvenient from discouraging me from driving up or down to support the local shops, or what was left of them, as as best I could. It was a bit slower, but not as much as I had expected. Though I would avoid Cal Ave during the lunch time rush
For many working people, especially with children, time is almost always at a premium. Being able to park out front without wasting time could make all the difference. Especially as it became less and less certain you would would be able to even find what you were looking for on Cal Ave as more and more retail disappeared. But even so, driving by the bakery might remind me a fresh loaf of bread and other temptations would be delicious, if I could park close by and run in and out quickly with minimal time wasted. But once parked maybe tempted to pop into the Bargain Box just to check out their latest donations, or perhaps quickly cross the road to the stationers to buy a card, wrapping paper, pens, or even remember to look for a gift for someone. Or driving by Country Sun reminded I could do with something they might have in stock, which might then tempt me to go across the road just to see what Leaf and Petal had in their window display, or the latest shoes and bags Jessica was selling, always a temptation.
It's been two decades since I could get almost all my shopping done in the Cal Ave business district. But a quick detour to drive up or down Cal Ave would still provide the visibility to remind me to patronize what was left of the retail and services.
a resident of Evergreen Park
on Oct 31, 2023 at 3:18 pm
CalAveLocal is a registered user.
@mgh, I live by California Ave. Before the pandemic closure, I have NEVER once been able to park on California Ave in front of a store or restaurant. In about 10 years. I am not joking. However, I could always park on the lot behind Starbucks or behind the Cobbler, and just walk up. Which is exactly the same thing that everyone can do right now, with an addition of a huge parking structure. As a working very busy mom, I can confirm that time is indeed the premium. As a result of that, I plan everything in my life, including picking up fresh bread or a new pair of shoes, or perhaps allocating a few minutes to browsing for just a perfect dress. All of our retail is destination stores. And that does not have to change!
a resident of Mayfield
on Oct 31, 2023 at 7:10 pm
Rose is a registered user.
I’ve lived in the Cal Ave neighborhood for 30 years. I was caught by surprise when I read that the City Council is again thinking about closing Cal Ave permanently. This would be a huge mistake. Why? Mayfield has very poor in and out access. The streets are very narrow and largely residential. Traffic pushed off Cal Ave spills into our residential areas. This is unsafe and unpleasant for our children, students, elders, and neighbors.
Cal Ave is the only street that provides good east/west movement to the shopping, businesses, groceries and CALTRAIN. We are blocked by train tracks, Oregon expressway, and bollards protecting Evergreen Park from cut-through traffic. It’s very tricky to move through the perimeters of the Cal Ave district. Try riding your bike east on Cal Ave through El Camino and on to the Caltrain station. Good luck. Closing the street is a mistake. Traffic needs to move smoothly without snarls.
The dead end at Ash Street and Cal Ave is impossible. Cars park there illegally all the time, making it impossible to do a u-turn next to Joanie’s Cafe. While they are trying to turn around (back and forth, back and forth) emissions go up as well as impatience and danger.
Our restaurants won’t die when we reopen the street — they’ll adjust just as they did when Covid hit. It’s past time to open Cal Ave to traffic. BTW the police will appreciate being able to maneuver more easily through this neighborhood when the new station opens!
a resident of Midtown
on Nov 1, 2023 at 7:00 am
SLK is a registered user.
Will reopening Cal Ave really help businesses?
I am sensitive to business owner concerns, but suspect that the post-COVID changes in customer behavior is likely the biggest driver of challenges faced by businesses. I doubt that opening Cal Ave would make it any easier on them.
And I have accessed the retail businesses more often since closure. I find if I have a choice of where to go in the city for services, I prefer to go to Cal Ave. Parking is not hard--the garages and street parking put you max only one block away from any business. Plus it is nice to stroll down the avenue. It feels like a community.
If anything, I am hoping that the city permanently closes Cal Ave and renovates it to be more beautiful, which would draw even more foot traffic.
Final word: the city could certainly do more to support Cal Ave businesses, road closed or not.
a resident of Evergreen Park
on Nov 1, 2023 at 11:31 am
Matt is a registered user.
Big compromises like this are for situations where there are large factions of stakeholders with opposing views. This does not apply here - the local community overwhelmingly supports complete closure to cars, and opening one lane (presumably with parking on one or both sides) is completely antithetical to what the community wants. In this sense, the one-lane option is not a real compromise. I love local businesses, but the community members are their customers and local business needs to adapt, as difficult as that may be.
I support the discussion here, and of course the business owners have a right to make their case and propose new options like this one. But community support for street closure has been very high for years, and the one-lane option (even a temporary implementation for study) will not change that. There has been plenty of time for considering options, and a decision needs to be made soon so that the work of making it a true pedestrian area can begin. I expect that a nice streetscape designed for this would help bring in new businesses as well. Prolonging the inevitable is not good for the community. Now is the time to make a decision and move forward.
a resident of College Terrace
on Nov 1, 2023 at 11:41 am
Monteban is a registered user.
If you have never owned a small business you should be quiet. You have no idea what it takes. The restaurants are far from thriving. And retail is dying. Soooooo why not open the street so someone can survive. Otherwise restaurants will close as well. We have seen so many restaurants come and go on Cal Ave throughout the years even when it was thriving . Places like Terun and Zareen would be easily replaced if they closed. But no restaurant is gonna want to open on a dead closed street. The guys from Sekoya want it open, Protege, Printer’s, La bodeguita and a few others as well. No one is safe on a dead street. When people say “ oh but it’s like Europe “ they have no clue whatsoever. Cal Ave is nothing like Europe. Maybe Eastern Europe lol. And maybe a few hours a week it feels like the closed street is actually working. But it’s not enough. The street is dead most of the time. In the winter time it’s gonna be worse. Next year will be worse. Reopen Cal Ave and stop wasting our dollars. They want to spend almost 400K on just trying to figure out what to do. Insane. Open up and see Cal Ave thrive again like Pre-Covid when the street was hopping. [Portion removed.]
a resident of Old Palo Alto
on Nov 1, 2023 at 12:10 pm
ForMelissa is a registered user.
Most of the comments here are in agreement that California Ave. would benefit from being opened up for traffic.
And I would agree with this. I am thrilled that University Ave. is back to having cars come and go. There are many reasons to open up California Ave. And most of them have been articulated by the other posters. So I will not repeat them. But just say that my vote is open California Ave. after these several years of it being closed to traffic.
a resident of Woodside
on Nov 1, 2023 at 12:25 pm
Joseph E. Davis is a registered user.
I see a couple comments to this effect:
'the local community overwhelmingly supports complete closure to cars'
What is this statement based on?
a resident of Evergreen Park
on Nov 1, 2023 at 12:43 pm
Midtown Citizen is a registered user.
I completely sympathize with non-restaurant business owners on Cal Ave. I love the Cobblery, get my hair cut at the Campus Barbershop, used to get my athletic shoes at Zombie Runner, and took guitar lessons in the basement of the building housing Joanie's. Even Country Sun was a benefit to locals like me.
But I'm also not convinced that opening the street to cars will save them. There is plenty of parking available in the lots on Cambridge and the new parking structure on Sherman; I parked in one of the Cambridge lots Monday afternoon to go to the Cobblery (stupidly, I didn't realize it is closed on Mondays) and there were plenty of available spots. I don't believe that Cal Ave has ever had a lot of "drive by" shoppers (like University does) that would substantially increase business for the non-restaurants; its not a main thoroughfare, so you either know a business exists on Cal Ave or you go somewhere else.
I don't think it is great for the city to have a restaurant-only "ghetto", but I think the focus should be on developing greater retail diversity downtown or even in Midtown rather than on Cal Ave.
a resident of Downtown North
on Nov 1, 2023 at 3:40 pm
Airbnber is a registered user.
If closing Cal Ave is such a great idea then why did City Council open University Ave? Because big businesses would not put up with the City Councils small town politics. Would Keen put up with making people walk a mile to buy new shoes? Nope. Would Apple put up with people walking to buy their latest $1000 ithing? Nope. Cal Ave has become City Councils tool of raising campaign funds because City Council first knee capped the area limiting businesses to non formula retail years ago, and now all the little businesses they claimed to preserve that Ole hippie feel are gone; if Country Sun is not a small hippy business along with Antonio's Beer garden, then what is? Clearly City Council has alternative goals for the street and it isn't to promote a vibrant community but a ghost town ripe for redevelopment.
a resident of College Terrace
on Nov 1, 2023 at 10:10 pm
NTB2 is a registered user.
I live in Cal Ave Mayfield College Terrace area. The location where the street is closed is not good. Why not push the closure further down and away from the heavily trafficked HWY ECR it buttresses. The intersection at ECR Cal Ave is horrible to everything and everybody moving through the intersection. How a city thinks having a water filled barrier closing on a major HWY is beyond me. Everything is badly planned . No Turns, right turns off Cal Ave.. .
How about a no right turn on red off of West/South Cal Ave (I know confusing, right?) what about all the confusing light post road sign on Cal Ave toward the train station. How about heavily striping the crosswalks at ECR or having blinking yellow cross walk alters signs. PA somehow refuses to study the traffic pattern outside the barrier at ECR. It’s a cross at your own risk. Long VTA busses whizzing by, bikes, scooters, dog walkers, U-Turns ok. Right turns with a grossly narrow bike lane at Wells Fargo. Sight line barriers. SRP and Stanford are a major contributor to the foot, bike, auto traffic .
It’s depressing scene at Cal Ave Closure. I avoid it and use Cambridge to walk and shop. As it is the restaurants whim the closure are hogging the open space and it’s not pleasant route to shop.
a resident of Downtown North
on Nov 2, 2023 at 8:23 am
TimR is a registered user.
California Ave is still closed to car traffic? I didn't know that! And I didn't realize it's been so long since I've been by there. It's a street that easy to forget about. But I guess that's part of the problem. Why would I go to California Ave, when we have downtown?
a resident of Barron Park
on Nov 2, 2023 at 9:40 am
Bill Bucy is a registered user.
I believe Midtown Citizen raises the most important point in the debate.
Do people really drive up and down streets to find retail stores or services? Of course not. What is important is reasonable access to the businesses they want to visit, something that already exists for CalAve. Increased marketing and promotion of the street's offerings as well as easy parking directions would help draw more people. And spending time on a well-designed, attractive, walkable CalAve would undoubtedly bring them back.
a resident of Evergreen Park
on Nov 2, 2023 at 10:48 am
Jeff Grafton is a registered user.
For the source of 'the local community overwhelmingly supports complete closure to cars' - see attachment E of the staff report for the upcoming city council meeting: Web Link
a resident of Evergreen Park
on Nov 2, 2023 at 11:05 am
Jeff Grafton is a registered user.
[Post removed; successive comments by same poster are not permitted.]
a resident of Barron Park
on Nov 2, 2023 at 5:12 pm
Ferdinand is a registered user.
As someone who shops and eats out mainly on Cal Ave Bill Bucy’s comments make sense to me—parking on Cal Ave has never been easy nor safe. In case this hasn’t completely sunk in with readers, if you live near Cal Ave you must choose to do a good deal of your shopping there if you want businesses to survive.
Marketing/promotions are needed (many locals don’t really know what is there), and the already mentioned side street signage for parking flow. Better planning on what retail is offered on the street needs attention. Some basic missing needs [opportunities] include a small stationery/computer supply store and—gasp—a pharmacy! Trends are cyclic, and we could use an art/craft store that stocks basic art supplies and includes quality yarns for knitting, some fabrics/sewing supplies. Before the hardware store a friend couldn’t even get a spool of thread nearby! How about something radical—bring back a casual, social gathering place such as Antonio’s Nut House and we’d see some traffic. The Alpine Inn remodel is a good example. Shops could be smaller or even combined for renting sharing. Can we get some tax reductions for these businesses?
The type of shoppers Cal Ave attracts is local—from south of Paly to Barron Park. I hope we care enough to keep it alive.
a resident of Professorville
on Nov 3, 2023 at 1:21 pm
Pogo2 is a registered user.
There are two certainties about the closure or opening of California Avenue, no matter what the decision, about half of the Palo Alto population will be happy, the other half will be sad. The other certainty, with the Palo Alto Process, it will be a long time before we will all be happy or sad.
My own view is not in consideration, but I lived decades in Boston and have traveled many European countries for work and on holiday and experienced the opening of the Boston Quincy Market area from a meat-cutter center to a first-class tourist area and I've enjoyed many happy times on European areas closed to traffic to accommodate street cafes and shopping. It needs motivation by the city to provide incentives for business to operate. I believe the parking garage is a start.
a resident of College Terrace
on Nov 3, 2023 at 1:43 pm
Red Wood is a registered user.
Navigating the myriad parklets is not the most aesthetic experience. I don't recall being polled for opinions, but it is not clear to me that, even so, majority vote would ever give sufficient weight to non-restaurant concerns. The apparent ban on even letting bicycles use the current sketchy layout is ambiguous, maybe best observed by exception. In the current stalemate, it looks like only what some consider an unsatisfactory compromise is the only way to keep a crack in the door open to returning to the good old days, i.e., the days before the trees were cut down.
a resident of Downtown North
on Nov 3, 2023 at 5:28 pm
Neilson Buchanan is a registered user.
It is really difficult to govern our city when so many opinions abound. I would like to understand how council, staff and citizens can make decisions when retail real estate marmkets are unnstable. Here is a good theory about underlying financing and "bankers" guide the leases (rent) presented to retailers and restuaranteurs.
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a resident of Evergreen Park
on Nov 6, 2023 at 11:31 am
sryan is a registered user.
I live near the California Avenue Business District and think the COMPROMISE PROPOSAL by the authors of last week's opinion piece makes sense. I read the posts on this thread from people that are proponents of keeping California Avenue closed forever. I am discouraged by their lack of concern for the businesses that continue to struggle with the Avenue remaining close. We have lost a sense of community and polite discourse, and yes, compromise. My takeaway is the authors of the COMPROMISE PROPOSAL opinion piece have not lost that spirit. Why are we not listening to what the business owners in the district are saying? I only hear and read that all the restaurants want California Avenue closed forever, but I do not think that is accurate. I have talked with many restaurant owners that do not want the street closed. And what about every other shop and service provider on California Avenue, and our local market, Mollie Stone's? Are they somehow less valuable to the community?
As citizens, we all suffered through the pandemic- some more than others. I admire the resiliency of business owners. The suggestion that allowing the restaurants to keep their outdoor dining spaces and give the non-restaurants visibility and access via auto lane seems to be a no brainer. I noticed in last Friday’s edition of The Weekly, there were over 30+ businesses that went on the record asking for the city council to do just that-reopen one lane...is it really that difficult? I understand there are extremes on both sides of this issue (again, read some of these posts), but what happened to the middle of the road (literally) majority?
I did have a good chuckle when one person posting here claimed that almost 80% of Palo Altan's want to keep Cal Ave Closed to cars. If you drill down just a bit though, it was from a survey almost two years with only 356 respnonse, out of 65000+residents?
Are we willing to risk the vibrancy of California Avenue based on, let us say kindly, an amateur survey?
a resident of Midtown
on Nov 15, 2023 at 10:09 am
Will is a registered user.
I support keeping Cal Ave closed to vehicle traffic. There is ample nearby parking and public transit to enable people like myself to visit in a car. I'm a frequent patron, and I usually drive over and park in the new parking structure. Even if Cal Ave was open to car traffic, I cannot imagine trying to navigate parking street-side. I don't think my patterns would change.
Frankly, I don't think that Cal Ave's struggles have anything to do with the modality of traffic. Taking the the case of Country Sun as an example, the Cal Ave area has TWO other groceries within walking distance, Mollie Stone's and Real Produce International Market. This neighborhood is not high density, I'm honestly surprised that 3 separate stores survived this long. If we're trying to claim that car traffic would save Country Sun, I think the market outlook looks even more dire because there's direct competition from a number of big chains like Grocery Outlet, Safeway, and Trader Joe's *within a mile*.
I mean are we really saying that businesses on Cal Ave are struggling in a way that stores on New Mayfield Ln aren't?
More generally, this is one of the first times in recent memory when the city council has simply made a decision, rather than wasting taxpayer money paying an endless stream on consultants to pontificate on the problem. It is darkly funny to see people in this comments section complaining about government waste and also asking for the government to second guess it's decision.
There are obviously long term changes needed to remodel Cal Ave into a pedestrian only space, but I quite like it the way it is today already.